Ep #129: Bonus Coaching with Casey - Part 2

Transcript:

00:00:00 Casey: All right, in this episode, this is part two of this bonus call that I hosted for folks that picked up some stuff that we were selling for Black Friday. And I got pretty deep pretty quick helping them coaching them through becoming a fractional CMO. So if you’re on the fence about becoming a fractional CMO, or you want to hear other people that are going through the process, and you want to learn kind of what their processes is, and how I coach them, tune in, and I’m sure you’re gonna learn something. Alright, see you soon.

00:00:26 Casey: Marketers of the world, why do we work hard to solve small problems? Why do we reinvent ourselves and our clients over and over? And why are we giving away marketing strategy for free? With advancements in AI, we’re all seeing the marketing department shrink from the bottom up and companies need you to serve them as their fractional chief marketing officer. It’s time to solve bigger problems and bring home a bigger paycheck. It’s time to create the lifestyle we deserve and to make a greater impact. This is the Fractional CMO Show and I’m Casey Stanton. Join me as we explore this growing industry and learn to solve bigger problems as marketing leaders. The Fractional CMO Show is sponsored by CMOx, the number one company to teach you how to attract, convert and serve high paying fractional CMO clients on your terms. 

00:01:23 Casey: So John, what’s going on?

00:01:25 John: Sure. Yeah. So I’m still early in the journey, looking into building up, you know, getting started. But I’ve been talking to a number of people who’ve been doing various types of fractional advisory consulting. And one of the things that’s come up a lot… 

00:01:35 Casey: Just a quick question. Are they making money or no? 

00:01:37 John: I think that generally speaking, most of them are making less money than they did as a full time, but they are happy with the result. 

00:01:44 Casey: Right. Okay. Well, that’s good. 

00:01;46 John: But one thing they brought up a lot and they kind of work in the same markets that I think I would be targeting, which is, you know, early stage companies that don’t have a lot of marketing staff of their own, right? And they said, well, the hardest thing that they have found is trying to help the client understand that you aren’t the person who’s going to do all the grunt work for them that they, you know, that they don’t do themselves. And so I’m curious, like thoughts on how to approach that and set that up from the start. Because, you know, that obviously can pull you into a rattle. And then, you know, it’s hard to claw your way back out of that. 

00:02:16 Casey: I just want to challenge the assumption that you should work with early stage companies who don’t have a marketing department of their own. Why do you want to be there?

00:02:24 John: But so it’s… it’s not necessarily to have no marketing department. It’s that they don’t have like senior leadership in place in a marketing department. Right. Like if they had that, they wouldn’t be looking for a fractional CMO or senior advisor. Right. 

00:02:35 Casey: Let me just say they might for a couple of reasons. One, skunk works. They want to develop a skunk works so they can invent a new thing, new product, new service and launch it without disrupting their status quo. Another one is they’re not happy with their current leader. They’ve overtitled them. I got pulled into a company with a very smart marketing director to do this way smarter than me but they didn’t trust him. So I led him, although I thought he was a very capable person, they just needed someone else there that they could have as like a level of strata. So those things do exist. But I kind of understand the general concept here of going to those companies. Okay, cool. So they’re doing revenue, then they’re not like pre revenue, right? 

00:03:12 John: Correct. Yeah, I mean, occasionally, you know, there could be companies who need just a project from marketing, you know, strategies. Vut I think that, you know, in cases where I think there’s opportunity and project work is a way to assess the client, it’s bounded scopes and well-defined. Like I would say that’s, you know, reasonable to consider. I wouldn’t do it just as a one-off, just because I think then you end up like, you’re negotiating for something small, which takes a lot of time and effort, right? But if it’s something that is potentially an entree, it’s much easier in some cases to walk in and say, hey, let’s do this one project. It’ll show you my value. And then let’s talk about like what it might look like to continue working. You know, to me, that’s a reasonable approach. 

00:03:46 Casey: Yep, reasonable, totally. Okay, got it. So what’s the big question behind this? [inaudible] you 100 times. 

00:03:53 John: No worries. Yeah, the big question is just that the people I’ve talked to who have been doing a similar thing have said that they’ve always been or I shouldn’t say always, they frequently find themselves in a position where they’re expected to do soup to nuts. And so they can try to go in and say, Hey, I’d love to bring in this additional resource, here’s an additional cost for that. It kind of like, you know, doesn’t fly. And so, you know, they have to try to figure out do I back out of this client? Or, you know, do I try to like, you reposition what they think I’m going to do? How do you think about that? As you know, to your point, it’s not necessarily that they have no marketing resources. It’s that they probably have no senior leaders and they lack the execution resources as well. And so they kind of expect someone to come in and like be soup to nuts. 

00:04:31 Casey: Right. Yep. Makes sense. So in that situation, I’m saying upfront that the work here is me with marketing talent. I need to bring in talent to do the labor. And there’s a couple of ways that we can do it. Maybe the team has remnant time available. I’m going to audit that early on. I’m going to have questions about that before the contract signed. So I’m going to say like, how many hours can you guys commit up team talent for me? They’re like zero. We’re understaffed and overworked. Okay, well, I’m going to need some talent if we’re going to work together. 

00:04:57 Casey: So I’m just going to ballpark here, I probably need between 20 and 40 hours a week of labor. Do you have anyone in your world right now that you could bring in to make this easy? Sometimes it’s someone’s kid or nephew or you know, niece or something like that. Other times it’s some freelancer that you worked with before. Sometimes people are like, yes, I got one. I was in a gym, John. I helped a gym, like a CrossFit training gym. And I was like, Do you guys have someone to like, yeah, we have a gym rat, he can’t afford to work out. So he sweeps the floors for us. And he seems like adept with technology. Turns out rock star, right? Just like didn’t have a job before. So we pulled him in and he did all the work. So that was easy. 

00:05:36 Casey: If they say no to those things that it’s like, great, well, I can write the job description. But my expectation is that we post this on the first day that we work together. And we’re able to pull someone in and you guys pay for them at 20 to 40 hours a week. That’s where it goes. And that’s the commitment for us to do this work together. I have to be very above board about my requirements for labor. 

00:05:57 John: So how would you think about it? Because in a lot of cases, you know, when you start working with the client, you actually don’t know the details of everything they do or don’t need. You certainly have some assumptions based on the discussions you’ve had so far, but sometimes it actually helps to be able to get in, you know, see the details and say, okay, now I can show you the plan and now I can show you the resources that apply to that in a more meaningful way. How would you approach it? Would you say like, hey, we’re gonna spend, you know, say a month, two months, whatever it is, like really assessing and getting to the right plan. And that will allow me to come back to you and show you what resources you’re going to need if you want to go ahead with that plan, or how would you approach that? 

00:06:28 Casey: Yeah, exactly. So the first 30 days is really the delivery of the strategy. So I just did this job with a client, I did it in the first 30 days. And it’s just like with Thanksgiving and everything, I was like, it’ll take us six weeks to do it. So Friday last week, I delivered my strategy to them. And all along the way, I told them all the stuff that I was finding. We had weekly meetings. met with… it’s a franchise. So I met with the franchisees, a couple of the different ones and reviewed it with the vendors, met with the vendors, you know, did all this stuff, gotten the CRM, played around. And I really identified what the problem was. I started fixing some of the problems early on. 

00:06:58 Casey: So example is the CRM didn’t track UTMs against the contact record. So I met with the developers and gave them an ultimatum that they had to deliver it to us by the end of the year. And they got me in a Slack channel and delivered it like three days later. That kind of stuff, right? So I’m like, actually making stuff happen. I get to the point at the end of it where I’m like, Okay, guys, here’s the presentation of the strategy, we can keep the CRM because they actually complied with our requests. And we need to do this stuff. We’re going to need these vendors to work with this type of agency that does this. I’ve got two ideas, but we could post a flag, a job post if you want, and we can put some of them. This is what that’s going to cost. Then we’re going to need a person to do this and a person to do that. These are the hours, these are the projects, these are the rough ideas of cost for us to move forward on. 

00:07:36 Casey: And you say to the client, like it’s binary. We can either do it all tomorrow, or we can do one project a month for three months, or, you know, some permutation of that. What works for you guys? And that’s it. And then my fee to oversee it and ensure that they do it to my level is a fixed fee. So it’s… we’re finding more and more that companies want that first 30 day eval. And then after that, you’re able to concoct what your service level is. I think it’s two levels, 10 hours a week, or four hours a month. So engaged or advisor, those are the two things that you sell after your first month. 

00:08:15 Casey: You can’t go into the advisor level sight unseen because you haven’t been paid for the strategy. And if you want pricing for that, I think you charge at least your engaged fee. So if you’re going to charge $10,000 a month for engaged, your first 30 days is at least 10K. I think can be 12. Because you’re putting in extra work, and there’s a risk that you might not keep the client. And also, there’s kind of the optics and benefit of like, I was 10… 12,000 for this, but to keep going, I’m only 10 feels nice for everybody. 

00:08:40 John: Okay, for sure. 

00:08:41 Casey: Yeah, but you’re totally right. It’s within a clear scope. It’s defined as a budget that they’ve agreed to. I think a cool way to look at this is SEO. Like if you want to dominate SEO for something, there’s a certain amount of content that has to be written and deployed on certain pages that to be linked in a certain way. It’s binary, you can ask 10 different SEO experts and they’ll give us generally the same idea. And let’s say that’s 1000 pieces of unique content. We know it to be true that we need to develop it. And they say to the client, what kind of budget do we have for this? What kind of budget do we have for the department? Should we do it all in one month? Or should it over the course of the next 18 months? 

00:09:16 Casey: It still has to get done, but we get to play with timelines to figure it out. And that can help the client be able to afford it. Cool. Good question, John. right. Corinne left. All right. Laura, you’re up. What’s going on? 

00:09:33 Laura: Sure. So I’m in early exploratory phase thinking I want to do fractional CMO at some point, but I’m not ready to make the leap yet. 

00:09:42 Casey: And what would you leap from? 

00:09:44 Laura: I work in CPG and retail brand management for consumer packaged goods, mostly food and beverage. 

00:09:50 Casey: You’re a full-time employee or you have an agent? Okay, great. So you leaving that would be… I mean, it’d be a risk. 

00:09:57 Laura: Yeah. And I have two small children. I’m not willing to do extra projects on top of a full time job. 

00:10:04 Casey: So do you have a spouse that has health insurance that would cover the family? 

00:10:07 Laura: Yeah, I do. 

00:10:08 Casey: Okay, cool. So then that is kind of a benefit. If and when you’re ready, it would be less of a leap. 

00:10:13 Laura: And yeah, exactly. Yeah. So I’m just trying to, you know, if I’m going to join the accelerator, that is a cost. And I want to make sure that I’m ready for it before I commit to something like that. So I’m thinking maybe in a year or two or whatever other experience I need to gain to both feel confident and gain some kind of external authority, credibility to jump into fractional CMO. So I’ve been head of marketing, briefed in as a director of marketing, but mostly senior manager level. So I’m kind of wondering, do I need higher level titles to help build my authority or is it just or maybe like… project based work, if that would be helpful. 

00:10:51 Casey: I think it’s your ability to tell a story. That’s it. So I’m sure you have enough today. There’s no meritocracy here that you have to have a CMO title for at least nine months before you can be a fractional CMO. We’re seeing a bunch of like Yahoo’s who have just sold, you know… they used to sell like media buying, and then they sold AI stuff and other fractional CMOs. And they like don’t understand how to do fractional CMO level stuff. So you don’t have to jump through any hoops. You’re good enough right now. 

00:11:20 Casey: A more… what’s the best way to say that? It’s not like intelligent, but like a more experienced business owner might want to see more of a track record from you. That doesn’t preclude you from getting high paying clients fast though. Right? Like you, let’s say someone’s interviewing you versus someone else and that other person has three more projects than you in a specific space, that could be a benefit, like, absolutely. But it doesn’t preclude you from winning that job, like from winning the gig. 

00:11:52 Casey: So I don’t think that there’s anything that you have to get on top of what you have. I think you should set your sights just to win your first client and let go of this belief that you need more. So like, how do you get one client? How do you work four hours a month less for your employer? And how do you add four hours with one client a month? And if you did that, I swear to you something in your brain will switch and you’ll realize what’s possible. And I can’t describe it. It’s like telling you what passionfruit tastes like if you’ve never had it. Right? It’s like I can’t but like the moment someone pays you $3,000, $5,000 a month for four hours of work, you’re just like, oh shit. Like, all I have to do is get in front of the right person and position myself appropriately. And then they see that this is the best solution for them. So that’s what I would do. I would just fight to go get a client sooner than later. So how can I help you get a client? What is like, where do you think you would get that client from in your network? 

00:12:50 Laura: I think similar to what some other people said is finding the right balance between their whether they’re too early that they don’t have the leadership in place, but they need marketing. So I think there’s a lot of CPG, food and beverage brands that need help with their marketing, their branding, you know, working with an agency, something like that. So, but some of them are also very early stage. Some of them are also really well-networked with all kinds of investors, giving them advice and things like that. So it’s somewhere in there. And I’ve got a good amount of connections already. But I don’t know how to assess their size. 

00:13:28 Casey: Can you just get calls scheduled with founders of these companies and just to chat with them? [inaudible] you’re being direct, you’re saying, Hey, I’m looking at getting in and working directly. I really, you know, you might have a line that this might be true for you. I’m missing depth with a single company. Like what I’m doing, you know, in my full time job, it’s great with the family, everything’s great. But I really just want to like work with, like a young company in the CPG space. And I really want to help them. And I want it to be in this space specifically, I want to like… maybe what is it in CPG for you that you’re excited about? Is there a specific like subset?

00:14:04 Laura: I mean, like the health and wellness brands that are growing and just like really hitting the trends, I think are pretty exciting. 

00:14:03 Casey: Yeah, great. So like the better for you, whatever it is, or health and wellness, you say I’m really… I just want to like go work with a company there. I’ve got all this experience and I really just want to go play again. I want to have the fun and the space to do that. Who do you know that I should talk to? That’s the conversation that you have and just go meet with these founders and sell nothing and just chat with them and hear where they’re at and ask questions about their marketing. And I bet you have enough conversations, you’ll find someone who’s like, Laura, how can we work together? You’re like, it’s a great question. I only have space for this. But here’s what it would be.I would go do a 30 day strategy build for you. And then after that, I would do, you know, monthly leading the team every two weeks, we’d meet together with the team, and I’d make sure you guys are all on track. But I want to be very kind of light, but very focused when we’re together. 

00:14:57 Casey: You offer that as an option with them. And I mean, I really think… it’s just that it’s a different experience that you’ll have with the work. And you’ll realize that you have it all within you right now. And what you don’t have, you know, like, you know, when you’re talking to someone, they’re like, All right, we want to get on performance max. Laura, can you help us? Do you know performance max? 

00:15:17 Laura: No, I can learn. 

00:15:18 Casey: Right. That’s it. You’re like, great question. On Monday, we’ll talk all about it. And then you go learn. You don’t need to get a specific piece of education that you don’t have to win the client. [inaudible] positioning and things like that. And like, getting the deal set. So it works well for you and things like that. But it’s not like you’re missing a tactic to serve them that you need first, or a pedigree. You got it. 

00:15:44 Laura: Yeah, well, a lot of times these people are like, you know, 24 started this company, maybe don’t have that much business experience. 

00:15:54 Casey: So yeah, so having someone like you… There’s two reasons that they hire us, they hire us for the impact, but they also hire us for like the surety, like the confidence. I just presented to this client’s franchise partners yesterday. And the co-founders like tuned out during the call, they’re like, awesome, I don’t even have to listen, you know, Casey’s gonna do his thing. And now I’m the person that’s responsible for it. And they can just now go think about selling new franchisees or whatever they want to do. And I’ll handle the marketing. So that surety is a big component of it. And you can provide that even if you’re not the best marketer ever, even if you don’t have the pedigree of being a CMO for 10 years. 

00:16:32 Casey: And I’ll tell you, Laura, we’ve got CMOs that are like, fancy. I’m talking like, big time CMOs like big deals. And these people think that they need a marketing tactic experience before they can go sell a client. Like I don’t know how Google ads work, therefore I can sell a client. So you have a mental block that you need something and they have a mental block that they need something, even though they have all the things that you want to have. So it’s more of a mental block than it is an actual block. 

00:17:02 Laura: Thanks. 

00:17:03 Casey: Yeah. Cool. And I really think what would be your commitment to like reach out, talk to people and win a client on the side, not threatening your job? You know, what would that look like? 

00:17:12 Laura: Yeah, actually, I have randomly talked to some CPG founder who connected me to three or four more this morning. So I haven’t reached out to them yet because I actually wanted to have this call first is feel like how I should position myself in those calls. So I think it sounds like getting to know you fact finding just like kind of listening about what their current marketing is, what their goals are, that type of thing. 

00:17:34 Casey: Yeah. Where are you guys? Where do you want to be? What are you doing for marketing? What’s working? What’s not? What are you guys excited about? You guys have a new product launches coming up? Tell me everything that’s going on. Are you guys getting on store shelves? What’s your e-commerce percentage of business look like? Are you guys doing Amazon FBA? You know, are you looking to get more sales direct to consumer? Just like ask all the questions. And simply by asking the questions, they want to work with you. You know, like they’re going to be like, I want to work with someone who’s that curious. I never thought of it. So if I create a future with you, you feel that the future is only possible with me. It’s kind of like the magic of working with someone. 

00:18:15 Casey: So in that conversation with them, they’re like, so we’ve got that product launch coming up. And when we talked to Laura, she said that, like, we’ll have to have a marketing department that makes sense. So we should probably hire Laura, you know, by February in order to do that. That’s their thought because they don’t want to say like, all right, now I’m going to go to ChatGPT or YouTube or whatever and figure out how to build all the stuff that Laura shared. I just want it done. The best clients want it done. So that’s what I would do just have the conversation asking questions. 

00:18:41 Casey: And at the end of your questions, just say, thank you so much. That was so informational. I really love these things that you shared. I’m really excited about you guys wanting to be you know, this. I like people personally that want to be number one. Like, why wouldn’t you just go be number one? Like you want to be the number one sweet potato company, sweet potato chip company? Sweet. Like great, like that’s a cool mission. I want to support that. So I would ask them, you guys are like in kind of a crowded market. Do you want to be number one? Like, where do you guys want to be? I kind of challenge their greatness. 

00:19:13 Casey: And then you get some of those people like, hell, yeah, we want to be number one. Cool. And then you transition to great. That was so fun. What questions here for me? How can I help you guys? And then they ask you, Can you help us? And you’re like, so I’m good. I’m starting this thing on the side where I’m going to advise one company. That’s it. That’s my offer. I’m just going to advise one company, I’m going to build that… I want to build out the strategy for one. I don’t know if it’s a good fit or not. Does that even sound like something you guys would want? And then they kind of chase you on it if they want it or they’re like, No, we’ve got it. You know, we hired a AI tool that’s going to do it all for us. You’re like, cool, good luck, you know, who do you think I should talk to? 

00:19:47 Casey: But inevitably, someone’s going to chase you, they’re going to want to know rates and things like that. So you just have to be rehearsed on that. Let me just ask you 30 days, you develop a full marketing strategy, do all the research forum, all that stuff, what would you charge 30 days? Assume it takes you 15 hours, 20 hours to do. What’s your fee? 

00:20:05 Laura: 10,000. 

00:20:06 Casey: Cool. It’s a fine number. Yep. So just 10 grand and that’s what you deliver. And that would be a one off thing with no ongoing commitment, because you don’t even know if you want it. And then at the delivery of that, it is inevitable that they can’t see that happening without you. So you eat it and say, and I’d be happy to share with you, I can help you guys for like four grand a month moving forward. Which feels really palatable. Like, you know, job number one is… here’s the job description, go post it, go hire the person, I’ll do a final interview of your top three candidates. And then I’ll assign them work. And every two weeks, I’ll check in with them, and they’ll do my bidding.

00:20:41 Casey: You’ll get so much done like that. And then you just make a couple grand. Don’t do it for the money. You know, don’t do it for maximum money. Like you could charge 5, 6, 7 thousand dollars for that work. But like just make it easy and get the sale. I swear every single person that does this, they get that sale and they come back to me and they’re like, I can’t believe I only charged what… I can’t believe I only charged $10,000 for that. That was worth 20. But you don’t believe it until you do it. Cool. 

00:21:08 Laura: Yeah, thank you. Very helpful. 

00:21:10 Casey: Yeah, and don’t leave your company. Right. And don’t do this on a work computer. Very important. Like have a separate computer because anything that you create on your work computer is owned by the company. 

00:21:19 Laura: Yeah. 

00:21:20 Casey: Right. Just be careful. Split things up. If you have a work email address, never use it. Use a personal email address. And it’s totally fine for you to obfuscate this stuff. One client will change it all. You don’t have to like build a whole website to win a client or anything like that. Yeah. Beth, hey. 

00:21:34 Beth: Yeah, I think I’m next. Hi, how are you? So I have quit my full-time job about two years ago. Just a bunch of life sucks that just led to a change. Fortunately, I was able to book some work, retainer work, and I’ve had that retainer client for two years now. I’ve had some side projects since then, but not really that ongoing kind of retainer work or retainer kind of CMO overseeing strategy work. So I guess my question is, this around building a good sales funnel. And I think as marketers, sometimes we have like FOMO, right? We build sales funnels for everyone, but doing it for ourselves seems like scary. 

00:22:17 Beth: But then on the second side of it is, you know, I’m in a fairly small market. I worked for a pretty large financial services business that was like 74th largest financial institution in the United States. Reported directly to the CMO in two various positions where I oversaw banks in a number of states and so forth like that. But in my Metro, it’s very small. And even as I look to Iowa as a whole, the largest bank is like, you know, our holding company with two and a half times the largest bank even sits in Iowa. Right. So like if I look at the big guys that I’d probably rather work with, just strategy-wise that can execute on things that are going to make shifts in their business, they’re probably looking at… they have a CMO, they have a full-time team. How does that look like? But I can bring perspective and how I’ve helped shift some sales to create some big impactful revenue numbers.

00:23:30 Beth: So that side, but then it’s also like that remote networking with people that, for the most part, I didn’t have peers in a, you know, decent radius. Most of our peers were like, you know, across the country and so forth. I was a leader of part, you know, my team itself was like 12 people. There was like 45 people in the department at one time, you know, so like really looking at that and how to kind of build that out and what some of your thoughts on that. 

00:24:02 Casey: Yeah, so just specifically, what’s the question? Like, how can I help on this? Like, give me the one question. 

00:24:08 Beth: I guess, like, right, so some of the insights that you shared is like, hey, work through your network, right? So like my network, while most of those people either are still at that business that I don’t know that I necessarily want to do business with them. So how to stretch my network and or how to build it online or remotely because my Metro isn’t a Metro that’s, you know, I’m looking… 

00:24:37 Casey: I hear you. Okay, so I live in Philadelphia, and I don’t leave my house. It’s kind of it, right? I didn’t leave the house at all yesterday. I didn’t even go outside. I don’t think. I don’t travel to meet clients. No way. I have one client I go see quarterly. And they’re like an hour and half drive away. If they lived farther away, if their offices were either way, I wouldn’t go see them. I had another client that was saying… I don’t know if–

00:25:03 Beth: [crosstalk] It’s not necessarily the servicing of the clients that I’m worried about. I’m not worried about that. It’s the acquisition of both. 

00:25:13 Casey: Yeah, I understand. So I exist as if I am living on the moon. That’s what I want you to hear. It doesn’t matter where you live. It matters who you want to go after that you go after them. If you have a book of business that you’ve worked before, and you can convert it like maybe Eric’s got some agency clients that he can convert, great. If you don’t have that, fine. I left an agency and I had a noncompete for two years where I couldn’t talk to anybody. And I didn’t want to either right like I’m by myself Beth, and I was living in an RV. So I didn’t have anything that I could leverage. I couldn’t leverage get togethers locally with any groups or anything like that. 

00:25:50 Casey: I did it all digital. And I just reached out to people directly. So I identified the total addressable market that I wanted, identified the pain that they were in, and offered them a solution. And that was it. And people booked calls with me. Is it the most… is it the highest returning platform? No, cold email isn’t great. But it’s also talking to 500 strangers every single day. It doesn’t take a lot of days before someone says, Okay, I’ll listen, you know, or you have my attention. What do you have? So cold email’s good.

00:26:19 Casey: LinkedIn posting is an effective platform too. LinkedIn posting has the benefit of… good content will kind of reach audiences that you’re not directly connected with. Like you’ve been… if you just take time and go on Facebook and scroll, you’ll see that maybe two thirds of the content you see is not people you follow. So we live in a world where we don’t look at content of people we follow, we look at content that is just pushed to us by the algorithm. So just write a bunch of content every day, write something new that’s smart. 

00:26:49 Casey: If you had a litmus, it’s make smart people think. That’s your thing. What am I writing about? Does it make someone smart think? Then do it. If it’s a little funny, that’s fun too. But smart, smart is where it’s at. I want someone to think of your industry, Beth, and be like, Beth’s the one I see her writing about this stuff all the time. We just had one of our CMOs yesterday report that she had two or three leads in the last week come to her only because of her LinkedIn posts. 

00:27:17 Casey: She’s just writing nerdy stuff that no one else can write because it’s her take on the world. So we have some process in the accelerator to do it. But the big idea is that if you’re the expert, you have to be seen as the expert. It doesn’t matter where you are. And it doesn’t matter. Like, you can’t go after this company. That’s fine. You can’t leverage your local network. Fine. There’s plenty of people kind of like in Laura’s position, which is they’re plotting their escape from a corporate job. And they need to still win business on the side to prove to themselves or oftentimes to their spouse that they can take the risk of leaving the job. And those people can still be successful. 

00:27:51 Casey: So yeah, it would be nice if you could reach out to all these people that you’ve worked with in the past, and they could pass you warm leads. But you have to be able to do it without referrals. If you can’t generate business without referrals, you don’t have a business, you kind of have like a charity or people throw you business. So that those are my… I think of it this way, last last big thought, if you were like, the FBI and you were tracking down a serial killer, what would your office look like? Would you have a cork board with photos of everyone and all the places the serial killer hanged in the string around it all? I want that for you, Beth. 

00:28:31 Casey: Define your target market and become a nerd. Who are the suppliers? Right? Who are the professionals? Who are the most active people on social media? What are the events that are happening? Go dominate it like go take this seriously. The trick isn’t go win a client. It’s the short term trick. But the long term trick is be the person. You know, the most authoritative thing you can do, I think, is you write a book. Like writing a book is heavy. You see people talking on YouTube or interviews or whatever, and they introduce themselves and they’re like, I’m this, this, and I’m the author of they never say and I get 50,000 downloads per podcast episode or I have a million YouTube subscribers.

00:29:12 Casey: They say I wrote a book. You can write a book. But you have to be the kind of person who knows so much about the industry and shares it in an interesting way that a book is compelling for people to read. So first become that person, understand the market, map it out. Like if you’re in… I’m in the franchise space, that’s the market I really like. Like, who are the people coming to the next franchise conference in Philadelphia? Have I reached out to them? Have I scheduled a hangout? Can I go show them around the city? I don’t even have to go to the event. You know what I mean?

00:29:40 Casey: I can just like create the pressure of like, hey, you’re coming to my city, let me walk you around. Let me show you Thomas Jefferson’s toilet. Excuse me, Benjamin Franklin’s toilet. It’s like my favorite thing to show people. You can find his sister and it’s like so silly. But like, I take people on a tour to Philly, and I create that connection with people. Do that kind of stuff. And you’re gonna win business. Don’t think that there’s like a sales pipeline. It’s conversations with people. 

00:30:05 Casey: The problem with our business model. This is the same problem with agencies is if someone doesn’t need it, they’re not going to buy it. So you have to talk to everybody. So when they need it, they call you. You got to be the person who’s omnipresent. So when they want it, you’re there. That’s it. Does that make sense? 

00:30:23 Beth: Yeah, it does. I did post a follow up question to one of your other discussions. I’ll maybe just hit on that since I’m on the mic. Can you talk about to your point how not to give the strategy way? I had a opportunity for a CML role. And I almost felt like to some extent, I gave not strategy away, but gave them the framework of what they should do to get the right seat. They have no marketing guidance. It’s a bunch of people doing it in-house and using a bunch of agencies. And I kind of laid the framework and then they said, great, and what would this cost? And then I provided what it cost. 

00:31:03 Beth: And then, somehow, you know, then they pick someone else. And it’s like, I just gave you everything. And I didn’t give them more than what like… your ads keep popping up. You have no framework around maximum time. I mean, I didn’t give them that much. But it was like nothing was more frustrating when it’s like I literally gave you the path and could get you operating. what– 

00:31:28 Casey: Did they hire somebody else?

00:31:32 Beth: They said they hired someone that they found themselves because I had kind of worked through like a headhunter that I knew… that was soliciting for that type of role. 

00:31:42 Casey: The fear of giving away the strategy is that they’re going to try to implement it themselves or hire their own talent to do it. If that didn’t happen, you probably did nothing wrong. Like there’s some level of strategy that I’m going to share, kind of like what it looks like. But I never quote people on costs of talent. So here’s what I’ll say to someone. I’m going to get this client that I closed like a month and a half ago. I said, Alright, so here’s what we’re gonna do. 

00:32:04 Casey: You guys have these concerns right now, right? You get concerned with this media buyer, you’ve got concerns with this ability to do follow up all these things. Yeah, I’m going to audit that. I’m going to review it. I’m going to propose a solution. My thought is the solution probably looks like us bringing some of these services in house. So these people work for your company, and that kind of stuff. And then we have to stay in touch with these leads. So we’re to do some regular content creation. We’ll talk about modality. Maybe it’ll be a podcast, maybe we’ll be video, I don’t know what it’s gonna be. But we’ll talk about it later. 

00:32:32 Casey: But that’s a general idea. First of all, does that even sound like what you guys want me to do? Yes. Okay, cool. You know, then pay me and then I’ll deliver that strategy to you. I still give them an idea of what it is. Yeah, it’s like an architect saying, I’m going to build you a house. You’re like, how many walls will it have? They’re like, well, at least four. Like, you got to give me more than that. So like, you got to give them something but you can’t… you don’t give them the like, technical design document of all the work that you’ll implement, because you don’t know. And I’m making these sales– 

00:33:04 Beth: I did just give them the quote unquote blueprint because to your point, it was like, okay, I’m going to do an audit. I’m going to do a marketing strategy. And then we’re going to engage on a fractional CMO basis going forward. Now I would say I– 

00:33:20 Casey: That’s sale of the fractional CMO being… was it kind of sold upfront to? 

00:33:25 Beth: It was sold up front to. But basically what we identified in the discussion, it was like, have all this stuff kind of all over with people not managing it that really know marketing. You’re like an expert in, this case, it was insurance and annuities and you know that really well, but you don’t know… you know, you’re engaging with all these agencies, but you don’t know… you’re not looking at your Google analytics to even see how it’s, yeah, go for it. 

00:33:54 Casey: Yep. Makes sense. So agencies give strategy away for free in order to sell services, you proposing the work that you’re going to do isn’t giving away the strategy for free. I don’t think you did anything wrong. I think they chose someone because it was a different price. They like them more for some reason, which you have no real way… that some people don’t like me. Some people think whatever about me. I’m an asshole. I’m whatever. Okay, fine, right. They’re never going to be my client.

00:34:23 Casey: I do think that if you said, I want to do this audit and then I want to sell fractional CMO services to you and that’s kind of the agreement. It’s kind of like we’re going on a first date and if things work out, we’re getting married. I think some people get a little freaked out about that. So I give them the out. So just as a point of coaching, it’s… I would do this for 30 days and deliver this. And then after that, we would have a discussion if you wanted my help to help make that strategy come true. 

00:34:48 Beth: I get where you’re going. Okay. That sounds good. But then how… It almost seemed… I tried to do like a monthly rate and then they’re like, no. Let’s price this out for each thing. But then it’s like, well, really, if we were doing a monthly engagement, I was saying a minimum… and I was planning on recouping some of that, you know, because the up. 

00:35:08 Casey: Yeah, that’s not the game. That’s not the game. The game is… okay. That’s… Is there a luxury car dealer or a fashion company near you? 

00:35:19 Beth: Yeah, sure. Like someone who carries luxury car. 

00:35:23 Casey: Yeah, honestly go there ask them the cost of something and then ask them if you can get a discount and just see their reaction. There’s just like, Oh, just no. The answer is no. So it’s like my fee for this is like… let’s do a project based you like make sense that you want project based. That’s not for me. I do it on fixed fees per month. And I go all in. If that’s not what you guys are looking for, I totally get it. And maybe I can recommend some other folks for you to work with. Next. And I’m going to walk away from that deal. they chase me, they’re like, fine, we’ll do the fixed fee. It’s like, okay, cool. But like, only have one way of going. It is a fixed fee. 

00:36:00 Beth: And that’s what I was thinking. I just wanted to like, make sure I was thinking about it correct. Cause that was… I mean, really the only longer term engagement that, that beyond my retain that didn’t bite at like, okay, let’s at least try with… And I gave them like the 30 day out that you would, to your point, you take each of these steps. I think the price just kind of shut, you know… maybe. 

00:36:24 Casey: And I think that’s a fair conversation for them directly to was the price too much. Can you guys just tell me candidly, what was the reason I’m not going to try to sell you? But what was the true reason here? What did you guys get? I would even reach out to them now. Okay, I’m just doing a follow up here just for my notes so I can get better. What kind of person did you go with? What was their cost? And what did you get out of it? And why did you choose it? And are you satisfied? Great. Thank you so much. I would also get that conversation so that you know if you want, but also let it go. I mean, some people are crazy. Some people are literally crazy, you know? 

00:36:56 Beth: Well, and I took it as like, don’t devalue myself. Because if I’m providing this service to others, and they’re willing to pay the price why it’s… you know, I shouldn’t devalue myself for them. 

00:37:08 Casey: Yeah. Okay, cool. I want to move on. Thank you, Beth. 

00:37:10 Angela: I’ve got just one and I think like throughout like you’ve kind of answered it like… 

00:37:15 Casey: Sorry, is that a real background? Because it looks really good. Yeah, it looks like an AI background. Okay. 

00:37:20 Angela: No, it’s not. This is actually wallpaper that I got from Target for like 30 bucks. And then I did that for YouTube. But yeah… you’ve kind of answered most of the question that I had and I’ve realized that it’s a mental block because I’m in a different kind of transition. did mostly… so I was working a full-time job and on the side I did project work. Left the full-time job… well, was let go. And then I jumped back into the project work, which has been going okay. 

00:37:55 Angela: But I just find that this transition from selling project work to selling fractional CMO work, even though I’m already doing it, because I find myself… a lot of my project clients really don’t have a strategy. So I end up doing it anyway, but I’m not charging for it. And so now I’m trying to transition into offering fractional CMO work, but the leadership part is kind of tripping me up. Like how do I sell the leadership versus the project? And I’m just getting in my head about that. 

00:38:27 Casey: So you need to understand what the company wants. Okay, think of it this way. Tell me again where you live.

00:38:36 Angela: Houston, Texas. 

00:38:37 Casey: Great. So you’re driving from Houston to my place in Philly. CEO says we got to go from Houston to Philly. And you say, cool. Let’s talk about finding the car. Let’s talk about going to the gas station. Let’s talk about getting out of Houston. Let’s talk about do we drive down 10 to go to New Orleans and head our way up or do we go through Mississippi? Right. That’s what you’re doing. What I want you to do is say, all right, in order for us to get to Philly, when do you want to get to Philly by? Okay, what’s our budget to get to Philly? Okay, cool. Now let’s talk about all the constituent parts of that. Right? 

00:39:10 Casey: A project assumes someone else understands the big vision, and only brings you in for the small thing. Your job is to zoom back out and be like, Hey, I get that you guys want me to talk about a project, but I got to the big plan. Where are we going in the next two years? Loop me in. So I got a client right now, Angela, and he brought me in. I feel this is so funny for me. It’s… he brought me in to do like personal branding. It feels silly for me. I don’t mean to like talk down on personal branding. But it’s like, I’m good at a lot of stuff. And like personal branding doesn’t feel like the thing. But it’s personal branding to increase his influence so that he can acquire companies. That’s a totally different game. 

00:39:51 Casey: So he’s like, Yeah, I want you to do some personal branding stuff for me. It’s like, I don’t want to do that. What are we really doing? He’s like, Oh, well, we’re gonna go acquire companies. Every year we want to acquire a company. And I’ve got this amount of money set aside for it. It’s like that has my attention. So now if I do this personal brand stuff, we increase his notability, then we’re able to do direct outreach to business owners who take us seriously, we’re able to fly out on the private jet, like we’re doing in January to go have a deal conversation with a company that’s potentially selling to us. That’s interesting. 

00:40:24 Casey: That first month, I did a little launch form, very transactional. Second month, another little launch form, right, small project work. But it’s all like, okay, when do we get to go do the acquisition stuff? Because that’s what we all want to do. So you have to be bought into that big picture and then small chunk it to maybe individual campaigns and projects, that’s fine. But you’re not getting paid on those projects. You’re getting paid for the ongoing oversight and success and the ability to achieve the two year vision. That’s all that it is. 

00:50:55 Casey: You’re just focused too close. Focus bigger and then just say, I’m going there. I’m getting to that place with you guys. First thing we’re doing is we’re launching this thing. Second thing we’re doing is this project. Third thing we’re doing is a new website. You just keep rolling them out. Once one’s done, you go to the next one. 

00:41:11 Angela: So, that… so here’s where the… I know it’s me, I get personally tripped up. So the way I decided to do this was to try and build a personal brand. And so I’m now getting some engagement and people wanting to talk to me, but they always come with a very specific thing that I talked about in that video that they want to know about. And so moving that conversation from that thing to the bigger picture is where I kind of get tripped up. 

00:41:42 Casey: I get it. So if people are coming to you asking for the small thing, how do you get them to think of the big thing? Are they even big enough businesses to do the big thing? 

00:41:50 Angela: They are, because that’s the way that I’m targeting. That’s the way that I’m writing my content and doing my videos. So yes, it’s just that because they’re not… they don’t have enough marketing knowledge, they think because I talked about that thing, that’s the only thing, right? If I talk about positioning, they think that that’s the only thing. 

00:42:08 Casey: I would have the conversation directly with them. They’d be like, yes, I’d be happy to do that. But before we do that, I can’t even start that work before I understand really where you want to go and your why behind it. I want to get a call together. And I want you guys to clue me in on the trajectory of the business. And then it’s your job to position yourself as the person that helps them make that dream come true and challenge them to be like that whole positioning thing. You guys aren’t there yet because you don’t have a product. You don’t need a position before… whatever. You’re going to help them choose the right thing. 

00:42:35 Casey: My fear is if you accept what they’re asking for, they might ask for the wrong thing. It makes you look bad. They waste money. They feel like, you know, you do step three first without doing step one and two. Now you’re the bad person, you know, because you let that happen. So that’s how you do it. You just like zoom back out, identify where they want to go, ask them all those questions before you accept their money. And I would just… would stay away from the project based work. If it’s project based, it’s for the first 30 days to prove. And then after that, you have an agreement that you’re continuing. 

00:43:03 Casey: Like I delivered with this client on Friday. And they were like thrilled and then yesterday we chatted. And I said, so we haven’t really stated it, but you guys want to move forward, I assume. They’re like, oh, hell yeah. Right? Like, that’s the feeling that you want. Oh, hell yeah. Like, absolutely. We’re going to. You know, and then they pay you and then you’re off to the races, you know.

00:43:27 Casey: And for us, I’ll tell you Angela that I am outside of contract right now. I don’t have a contract formally with this client, because I don’t know yet how they’re going to pay me. We’re figuring that out. They know my fee, but we’re doing an upside thing. So I’m working probably for the next two weeks without being paid in the anticipation that we get it all in by the end of the year, and then I’ll be paid that upside, you know, factored in appropriately. So that’s me buying into the long term with them, not caring short term about the cash pay, knowing that it will come out in the next month or so, everything will be sorted. The most important thing is that we’ve locked into a contract for two years together. Does that make sense? 

00:44:07 Angela: It does. It does. 

00:44:08 Casey: So there’s a ton of projects, they asked me over the weekend for a project to work on. And I was like, I can do it. It’s going to increase our scope. It’s like, cool, let’s talk about it. Great. So we can talk about all those things, because it’s unlimited the things that I can work on given enough time. And we’ll just kind of see what happens. But the commitment first is… a commitment and acceptance of my rate, and a commitment to a term length of at least two years. 

00:44:32 Casey: Now I’m different. Our CMOs aren’t all doing two year contracts, but that’s just where I’m at. So that’s what I’m locking into. If you can get there, then it doesn’t matter what the project de jour is, you know, you’re going to be able to support them. Am I missing something? 

00:44:47 Angela: No, no, no. Then like I I know that it’s it’s like an internal thing that I have to like kind of–

00:44:52 Casey: That’s literally a question. It’s not an internal thing. It’s an outward question. Before I can take your money, I got to know where you’re going. So I can do it right. Yeah, make sure that this is the right thing for you. Let’s schedule a call. I’m gonna ask you a bunch of questions about the business and the trajectory. if they’re unwilling to do it, they’re not your client. And if they’re willing to do it, then you’re just going to identify all the work that you can do in the future. And then you position yourself as a fixed price CMO for 10 hours a week. That’s it. And the protection for them is great. Budgeting for project work sucks. 

00:45:24 Angela: It does. 

00:45:26 Casey: Budgeting for a CMO, that’s a flat fee every month is easy. You feel good? 

00:45:31 Angela: Yep. 

00:45:33 Casey: Okay, great. Rachel, do you have anything you want to chat about? I don’t see any notes from you in the chat. 

00:45:37 RacheLaura: No, I’m mostly just listening. I’m still in the… I do a lot of project based work. I went out into business in August. I quit a toxic job by [inaudible] and I’ve been rolling ever since. 

00:45:51 Casey: So how’s your nervous system? 

00:45:53 RacheLaura: I think it’s good. I am. This is the least stress I’ve been under in a long time. So I will never go back to work for anyone ever again. I don’t think… I like being on my own and doing my own thing. So but right now I’m really working on… I have a CEO, a woman who just became a CEO of a company. We used to work together. So she’s sold on me. I’m just working on trying to get her to sign for the fractional. And so right now I am doing some project-based work for her just to keep my… really keep myself top of mind. So I’m actually thinking about reaching out to her today to say like, hey, we talked about 2026. We’re coming up real fast on that. What do you think about me putting together a Q1 plan? 

00:46:40 Casey: Yeah, it’s full annual. Full annual, yeah. 

00:46:45 RacheLaura: Yeah, well, so I mean… this would be hourly. So I’m thinking if I gave her just a taste. 

00:46:52 Casey: Why couldn’t you go for the full commitment right now? 

00:46:54 RacheLaura: Because her executive team isn’t on board yet. So that’s why we started doing this project work because she said her executive team is still, I… she just became CEO about a month ago. So I think they’re, you know, maybe a little bit… it sounds like they’re a little bit nervous about bringing someone like me on board. Like, so she’s sold. It’s the rest of the team that’s still not sure. So I’m just figuring out, you know, how can I get her… and also if she’s kind of squirrely, you know, she’s like the client that’s always really overwhelmed and needs a little bit of wrangling. And I know that from having worked with her when she was a chief customer officer. So I’m just figuring out like, how do I get her… I want to try to nab her now, you know, so that way I could potentially get her to sign to something a little bit bigger than just hourly work, hourly projects in part. 

00:47:49 Casey: There’d be a conversation that I would have that would be something like, um thank you so much for the work so far. I’ve been having a lot of fun. It’s fun to work with you again. um I’d have this on a phone call, just like a check in. And just be like, I’m just planning my new year and I want to make sure that I have capacity for you guys. And I’d like to get something formal. And I totally understand that you’re the new CEO and it’s going to take time. I’d like to earmark some hourly work for you guys, if we can kind of get that locked in. And, you know, what’s your hourly rate? 

00:48:20 RacheLaura: Right now, just 125. So pretty low. Yeah. 

00:48:25 Casey: Problem is that’s gonna be hard to increase that. Yeah, if you’re doing it on a committed length. But let’s say you do. So you’re at 125 times, 10 hours a week times four weeks. You go $5,000 a month, let’s just say, I want you to try to bill $5,000 a month in work with her. But how… I want to earmark like 10 hours a week for you guys because of these products that we talked about. I think that’s what’s going to take maybe a little bit more. And I’d be happy to go through the month of January with you guys just kind of on the hourly for it. But then after that, it’d be really nice to just like formalize it. And if we can’t formalize it, I get it. I just have to increase my rates by 20% just to take into account that it’s hourly and not fixed price. 

00:49:09 RacheLaura: Yeah. And I mean, and I had quoted her 5000 a month back when I sent a proposal… November, yeah, November 10th. So, and that’s when she was kind of like, eh, they’re not ready yet. So… and her team was really nervous, you know, about somebody else just coming in, which I get, I’ve been there. So yeah, I think that’s a really good plan. I’ll use it just as a… I mean, it’s been a month since I sent her the proposal, the initial proposal too, so. 

00:49:40 Casey: And it’s just a conversation as it’s like, I need to do this for me. I’m taking care of me here. You don’t need to. And also, I think it’s gonna be easier for you guys to budget because… the easiest thing to budget is a fixed fee. But I would get my right there as quickly as possible just to kind of validate that they can afford it. 

00:49:57 RacheLaura: Yeah, yeah. 

00:49:58 Casey: Like 4800, 6200 month over month, you know, whatever, you’re like five grand flat feels pretty good. It’ll cover mortgage or whatever you got. Right? Life’s good with a single client paying you at least five grand for sure. 

00:50:10 RacheLaura: Yeah. Yeah, when I’m lucky, I have another one that’s 6k a month right now. So like, I’m not super worried. And we took this risk knowing that we can afford, you know, for me to make less. 

00:50:23 Casey: Great. Okay. But you should make a lot more. 

00:50:26 RacheLaura: Yeah. Oh, yeah, for sure. I would like to be at least back to where I… what I was making before I quit, you know, working corporate. 

00:50:36 Casey: I think it’s very reasonable to. And for… I mean, if you think for you, it’s like one client at 10k on top of these two and you’re rock solid. 

00:50:45 RacheLaura: Yeah. And you know what the of living is in Lansing? It’s – This is a good place to live. Pretty cheap. 

00:50:51 Casey: Is that diner still there with the hippie hash? Yeah, it’s got to be Fleetwood. 

00:50:58 RacheLaura: I think so. I don’t go downtown much. 

00:51:01 Casey: Fleetwood– 

00:51:02 RacheLaura: Like you, I don’t leave my house very often.

00:51:07 Casey: Fleetwood is a classic that they do like a hash with FEDA. It’s like my first experience at FEDA. It’s like Mount Hope at Cedar. 

00:51:15 RacheLaura: Okay, yeah. I rarely go to that. I’m such on the opposite side of town that I tend to stay over in Hazlitt, Oklahoma’s area. 

00:51:22 Casey: Okay, cool. 

00:51:22 Eric: It says they’re still open as a 24-hour venue. So you’ll have to jump. 

00:51:26 MichaeLaura: I’m looking now. It’s still open. It’s good. 

00:51:28 RacheLaura: Only the students are… I mean, they should be all gone by this point. So like… between now and when the semester starts, that’s when you go downtown. When the students are around, I try to avoid it. 

00:41:40 Casey: There was a place though, Great Harvest. Oh, man. You know Great Harvest on Allegan. 

00:51:47 RacheLaura: I haven’t been there either. No. 

0:51:49 Casey: Oh, my God. Okay, I just have to tell you… it’s the kind of place like where dreams are made. Like terrible outside waiting in the line. No, I guess they moved one down. No, this was in like an old gas station and it was just like knickknacks all over the place. It was awesome. 

00:52:12 RacheLaura: You said Great Harvest. 

00:52:13 Casey: I think it’s Great Harvest. Yeah, Great Harvest. 

00:52:17 Eric: Yeah, Great Harvest Bread Co. That’s what it looks like. 

00:52:21 Casey: It’s Golden harvest. Golden Harvest. Let’s see… on Turner. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. That’s it. Yeah. So it’s like… 

00:52:28 Eric: Got a good following.

00:52:30 Casey: Yeah, and it’s kitschy, right? 

00:52:33 Eric: It’s literally a description of wall to wall kitsch. 

00:52:36 Casey: Totally. Yeah, like this is it when you wait in line. Oh, it’s a total gem. And they have like, you know, the great French toast. Oh, it’s so good. So much fun. Great, great, great place. So if you ever go, [crosstalk], go look at the $10,000 guitars. It’s a great trip.

00:52:56 RacheLaura: I love that I’ve lived here for five years and I’m like, I have not been to any of these places. But my husband’s a really great chef. So very often we just… I let him cook for me. 

00:53:02 Casey: [inaudible] dream. Yeah. You need like a good 2 a.m. hash with like people smoking at the booth next to you. That’s the spot for you. 

00:53:19 RacheLaura: That’s good to know. 

00:53:21 Casey: All right. Well, we’re reaching the end time. Tracy, I don’t know if you’re a human or if you’re an AI, but if you’re still here, hey. If you have any questions, let me know in a second. But otherwise, I’d love for you guys just to book a call with the team if you want to chat more and see if we can help you. Yeah, anything else, Eric, before we split? You good? 

00:53:36 Eric: No, I think I’m good. This has been great. Very valuable information from everybody else, too. So it’s going to help me really hone that direction. 

00:53:42 Casey: Yeah, I can think we’ve got a member who kind of joined a call like this last year and then just sold a bunch of business and brought in things at $20,000 a month. Join the accelerator, jump right into boardroom. He’s having a ton of fun. And he was just about to sell his company and I coached him out of it. Because the amount of money that he would sell for versus what he can cash flow, he’s gonna make more cash flowing that business that he would, you know, exiting it soon. He could exit in a few years too. I think that there’s an opportunity for that. So alright, well, thank you all for being here. Take care. 

00:54:13 Casey: Thank you for sticking around for the full episode. As you know, learners are earners, but you’ve got to take action on what you heard today. For more information and show notes, visit fractionalcmoshow.com. If you’d like me to answer your questions on an upcoming episode, you can share your question at fractionalcmoshow.com. And last, please hit the like and subscribe button so that I know that this content is helpful to you. All right, go get them.